Women of Fenn College Oral History Project
Dorothy Wood Plisky (MED, 1980)
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Interview conducted through Cleveland State University's Mary Joyce Green Women's Center.
Transcript:
SPEAKER 1: I'm speaking with Dorothy Plisky, class of 1958. Dorothy, what are-- what is one of your favorite memories from your Fenn days?
DOROTHY PLISKY: Oh, my favorite memory? Well, meeting my husband.
[LAUGHTER]
Yeah.
SPEAKER 1: OK, now everything's coming through good.
DOROTHY PLISKY: Good. OK.
SPEAKER 1: So let me-- I'm speaking with Dorothy Plisky, class of 1958 Fenn. Dorothy, thank you for taking part in this little exercise. And tell me what you remember best about your days at Fenn.
DOROTHY PLISKY: Well, I think my best-- truly, my best memory was just the opportunity to go to school. Because there certainly wasn't any other way I would have gone to school, any possibility. I lived with my mother and my grandfather. And as most Fenn college students and Cleveland State students, there wasn't a lot of money. So it was-- I had worked in a library at Shaker Heights. And the librarian said to me, you're going to school, aren't you? I was a senior in high school. And I said, no. I'm not going to school. She said, oh, you have to go to school. And I explained my circumstances to her. And she came back the next day and said, I set up an interview. She was a very strong personality kind of person. She said, I set up an interview for you at Fenn College. And she said, you're to go at such and such a date and talk to Dean Monsanto. Was that her name? Yeah. And I take an entrance exam. And so, you know, I just felt extremely fortunate. And I came home. And I mentioned it to my mother and she kind of gulped and said, I don't know how I can help you. And I said, well, as long as I have a roof over my head. And I said, think I can do this. And the first year, I think I had a PTA scholarship from Cleveland. But I think having an opportunity, for my generation, because my parents probably only had a seventh or eighth grade education. I think having that opportunity is a wonderful memory for me. Just saying, wow, I could do this. And I think all the women who went to Fenn probably felt the same way. I think there were just one or two who weren't in the same predicament that the rest of us were in. And so just having that opportunity was a great, great memory and still is, you know.
SPEAKER 1: And you took public transportation to get to Fenn?
DOROTHY PLISKY: Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. [LAUGHS] I took a bus from 131st Street to 150-- gosh, what was that? It took me through Shaker Square and down into the University Circle area. I think that's 107th and Euclid. And then from there, I transferred over.
And then in the last two years of school, my mother and I went in on a beat up old car. [LAUGHS] Because she wanted to learn to drive. And I had-- I was working for-- doing co-op work for Cleveland Schools. And they asked me if I would work in a community center at night. And the pay was good, but I had no transportation. So one of my uncles made arrangements for my mother and I to get a car. So that when I worked two or three nights, I had this old Ford that thundered here and there from school to school. So you know, I had a lot of good opportunities, a little luck.
SPEAKER 1: Yeah. What are some of the other memories you have of the classes or the teachers?
DOROTHY PLISKY: Well, I think it was a shock. [LAUGHS] Because I was not prepared for college at all. I had taken secretarial courses. And so I really was not prepared. And I didn't come from a home where reading or any kind of academic work was-- and I'm not faulting my family. That's just the way it was. I was that way with a lot of families. And so it was difficult for me. I had a tough time. But my favorite-- I think my favorite teacher was a Mr. Ink, Joseph Ink. Yeah, he taught-- you remember him?
SPEAKER 1: I remember him.
DOROTHY PLISKY: Yeah, he taught World History. And I knew a lot about the history of Europe. Because of my grandfather, who was from Prague. And so you know how teenagers are. They just, yeah, grandpa, yeah, yeah, yeah. He kept telling me. But it must have sunk in. Because when I got into Mr. Inks class, I knew more than what I thought I knew.
SPEAKER 1: Now that's good.
DOROTHY PLISKY: And he had us answer essay questions in an interesting way. He had us answer him according to the philosophy of the time, the arts of the time, meaning music and literature. And the kind of government and economics at the time. So he-- the way he presented his class really appealed to me. Yeah I think he was-- oh, and then I liked-- jeez, I forgot his name. I liked my education teacher, too. Mm, boy.
SPEAKER 1: It wasn't Sampson, was it? Dr. Sampson?
DOROTHY PLISKY: No.
SPEAKER 1: Dr, umm--
DOROTHY PLISKY: One of them was Dr. Rosencraft. And then there was another one who I really liked. And they were very encouraging to me, very. Because I had started out in sociology. And they kind of guided me along. Oh, and another instructor I had was Dr. Jordan. He was an elderly man who taught Sociology. He was a neat guy. And Dr. Cousins, who taught American-- you remember him. He taught American History. He was good, too. I guess I liked History.
SPEAKER 1: Yeah, but you didn't teach history.
DOROTHY PLISKY: No. [LAUGHS]
SPEAKER 1: What did you--
DOROTHY PLISKY: Well, let's see. I had kind of a smattering. I taught first grade, second grade, third grade, fifth grade. I had a couple of years of LD. And and I'm tutoring now, kindergarten children. It seems I've been demoted.
[LAUGHTER]
But I can under-- it's kind of difficult with these very young children. Because the curriculum has changed. And it's very demanding. And it's hard on the teachers. So I feel like I'm in there helping the teachers, these young teachers. And that's rewarding.
SPEAKER 1: This is in Bedford Heights?
DOROTHY PLISKY: This is in Bedford. Bedford has four suburbs. It's Oakwood, Bedford, Bedford Heights and Walton Hills. So yeah, that's where I taught. I did teach in Cleveland for about five years. And then the rest of my teaching, when my children were a little older, I went back. And since I lived in the Bedford area, I applied for a teaching job there. And so that was where I spent my years.
SPEAKER 1: When you were at Fenn, was there any-- did you feel being a woman in that school was difficult? Because there weren't a lot of women who went--
DOROTHY PLISKY: No, no, no. I think it's because I was in the field that I was in. There were enough of us that were nurses and arts and science people, and we were in education. And that group, the few-- I'd say at the time, I imagine there were about 25 or 30 of us. Wow, huh? [LAUGHS] And we were friends, good friends. And so we supported each other. However I do feel that some of the gals who were in engineering or the business, I think it was a tough road for them, especially the engineering. But they were sharp. They were really good. And very good students and had to admire them. No nonsense. The rest of us were kind of silly.
[LAUGHS]
SPEAKER 1: Well, you're supposed to have some fun.
DOROTHY PLISKY: Oh, sure, sure.
SPEAKER 1: Do you remember any activities or any of your social activities or anything that you did?
DOROTHY PLISKY: Yeah. I belonged to a sorority for a short time. And we had some good times with it. But I kind of dropped out because-- it wasn't done because I didn't like anyone. I liked people that I was with.
It was just, I was working part time and going to school part time, and I met the love of my life. And I had responsibilities at home. And I didn't have time for all of that, for the sorority activities.
And they even though it wasn't like a sorority on a large campus, there were certain amount of things that you should participate in. And I really didn't have the time.
SPEAKER 1: I think that's true of a lot of the people that commuted in this.
DOROTHY PLISKY: Oh yeah. Oh yeah.
SPEAKER 1: Especially on co-ops. Because you weren't there--
DOROTHY PLISKY: That's right.
SPEAKER 1: The co-ops, if you were co-oped in the schools, did you go into the different schools when you were co-oping?
DOROTHY PLISKY: Oh, yeah.
SPEAKER 1: Do you remember any of them?
DOROTHY PLISKY: Oh yes.
[LAUGHS]
Oh my gosh. The first school I was at was Harvey Rice School off of Buckeye. And it was the sweetest school. And I just loved it there. And I had-- I was co-oping in a kindergarten there. And the teachers were wonderful. And I co-oped at a school called Bolton, which was on Carnegie.
And that was challenging. I remember one of the kids-- she had such a large-- a very large-- it was like 42 children in her kindergarten class. And they were a hard group to control. Maybe you don't want this taped, but one of them climbed out the window.
I ended up. She said, go get him. And I ran out the door on Carnegie Avenue and grabbed this kid.
[LAUGHS]
So it was a challenging school. And she was so patient. Oh my goodness, that woman was so patient. So she taught me that. And then I taught-- I worked at Corlette School on 131st Street. And I worked at Rickoff School, I co-oped
SPEAKER 1: Who was the principal at Rickoff when you were there?
DOROTHY PLISKY: Oh, a delightful Irish lady. Her name was Mrs. O'Reilly. And she had the whitest hair and the bluest, bluest eyes. And she was so sweet. And she taught me something that I will never forget. Because my personality is such that I'm a little bit of a scatterbrain. Maybe not even a little bit. Maybe a lot. I start one thing and go to another. And she would say to me, now Dorothy, first thing's first. That was her favorite saying. I must have heard it five times a day, you know? So she was a sweet lady, very nice.
SPEAKER 1: We had a principle when I was co-oping that I think it was at Rickoff too, but it was Mrs. Miller, or Ms. Miller. Genevieve Miller.
DOROTHY PLISKY: Well--
SPEAKER 1: It was maybe after that.
DOROTHY PLISKY: Yeah. Mrs. O'Reilly was-- I would say she was ready to retire. Although her personality, I mean, only age-wise. But she was very well organized and very soft spoken, and really was a charming lady to work with.
And the two principals that I worked for at Corlette and Mrs. O'Reilly at Rickoff, didn't want me only to work in the classroom. And that was-- they wanted me-- did you have any experience too where you worked in the office?
SPEAKER 1: Yeah.
DOROTHY PLISKY: Yeah, they had me doing some filing and recordkeeping.
SPEAKER 1: Mineographing?
DOROTHY PLISKY: Yeah, some of that. But just, I really did appreciate, they showed me a lot of things how the schools ran. And that was a good experience. And I'm a product of Cleveland schools, so it was kind of fun doing that. And I also worked playgrounds, too, Cleveland playgrounds. Dusty, dirty, hot.
SPEAKER 1: Kids.
DOROTHY PLISKY: Kids. And I'll never forget. I was lucky. I worked with a really great fella. He was very considerate and very helpful. And we decided to take the kids to a Cleveland Indians game. And two of them decided to go off on their own.
And we were just panic stricken. We looked all over for those children. And that was in an area that was at Todd Playground. That was on-- near Saint Alexis Hospital in
that
area.
And I can remember taking the bus and walking there and every day smell, what's that wonderful smell? It smelled like pork chops to me. Well, it was Dan Dee Potato Chip Factory. And it was-- the kids were pretty good. Some of them were a little tough, you know? But we did find the two.
SPEAKER 1: Oh, thank goodness.
DOROTHY PLISKY: And read them a riot act. Don't ever do that again. Two girls.
SPEAKER 1: Girls?
DOROTHY PLISKY: Yeah. 12 and 13. So I'll tell you, co-op was a good education.
SPEAKER 1: It prepared you.
DOROTHY PLISKY: Absolutely, absolutely. And at that time, you didn't earn a lot of money. What was it, like $1 an hour or something like that. But if you saved it, you had enough for your next quarter. I don't think that's possible today-- I know it's not possible today.
I've got a granddaughter in college and I'm shocked at what my son has to pay. But thank goodness he can do it. So we really-- we had a golden opportunity. I always say, it's almost like someone was looking out for us, watching us.
SPEAKER 1: And you met your husband?
DOROTHY PLISKY: Yes, I met my husband when I was a freshman. And he was back from Korea. So he had registered. He had gone to night school before he was drafted. And he encouraged me to finish school.
After I met him, I didn't think it was necessary for me to go to school. But he said, no, if I'm going to go, you're going to go. So we both went. And he graduated in '57 and I graduated in '58. We were married in '57. So we've been married 50-- we would have been married 51 years.
So yeah, I was very fortunate. He was really-- he was an accounting major and a very good student, and actually taught me how to study some things. Because I can remember the term papers that we had to have. And I think I had Dr. Tuttle and Dr. Cherubini.
And they would go over your papers. And you know, kids today whip them out in 10th, 11th grade. And here we were freshmen, didn't have a clue how to do a term paper. And I would do my rough draft and show it to Don, and he'd say, oh, Dorothy. We have some correcting to do. He was very kind about it. So he helped me.
I had-- my writing skills were not good. I mixed tenses. I guess it doesn't matter today. But at that time, they were fussy about that. You just didn't do that. And my husband said, you've got a couple of split infinitives here. What's that?
[LAUGHS]
Anyway, it was-- I think God was watching over me for many reasons. Yeah, I was very fortunate. So school was a good experience for me. It was a tough experience for me, because like I said, I wasn't prepared. But once I got rolling, I was fine.
And then in the late '70s, I went back to Cleveland State to get my masters, and accomplished that in 1980.
SPEAKER 1: Was that a master's in education?
DOROTHY PLISKY: Yes, it was a master's in curriculum.
SPEAKER 1: Curriculum.
DOROTHY PLISKY: Yeah. So it was a good experience. That was good too. And it was kind of fun going back. There was a funny story too with that. You might not want to tape this, but it's funny. I had a French professor-- well, hear it out. You can erase it. If I had a French teacher. Remember, Professor Small?
SPEAKER 1: Oh, yes.
DOROTHY PLISKY: And I had a struggle with French. Because if I look back on it now, why didn't I study it, review it, when I was in co-op? But I didn't. You didn't want to. And so then when you went back, it was like, what's he talking about? And so I struggled through it and I got through a French. And when I went back, I must have made some kind of an impression on him. Because when I went back for my master's and I was registering and I got into the elevator, Mr. Small, Professor Small got on the elevator, a little old-- quite a bit older, and he looked at me and he said, Ms. Woods, are you still here?
[LAUGHTER]
And everyone in the elevator, I tried to explain it. Are you still here? Yeah, I'm still here. Oh, a little humor.
SPEAKER 1: Well, humor is what gets you through things.
DOROTHY PLISKY: Yeah, yeah, that's right, that's right.
SPEAKER 1: Did you make many friends that have lasted through the years?
DOROTHY PLISKY: Yeah, and the funny thing about it is we lost track of each other for a while. And the past five years, we've been-- there's three or four of us that meet for lunch. And three of them were teachers. So yeah. Well, that's another name I can give you is Ruth Shepherd. She lives in Strongsville now, so that'd be right near you. And we went to school together. And she taught for many years. And she also got her masters. But she got it at Baldwin Wallace. She earned her master's there. And taught in Berea for, I guess about 30 years. And we still keep in touch.
SPEAKER 1: I find that in talking to some of the ladies, that they have some of the sorority people have kept going. They have lunches and stuff, so that it's interesting.
DOROTHY PLISKY: Oh, that's good.
SPEAKER 1: Yeah, people-- you do make friendships.
DOROTHY PLISKY: Oh sure, sure. Sure you do. And even friendships outside in a different sorority too. My husband and I moved to Boulder, Colorado for-- we were there for about four or five years. And I had just put my kids down for a nap, and there was a knock on the door. And I looked and I thought, Ursula. Ursula Shlom. What are you doing? She had a huge German shepherd with her. And she was in another sorority, but she grew up in the same neighborhood that I did, you know? And she's-- she was from Germany. I mean, she was a United States citizen. But she came to this country shortly after the Second World War. And she was an engineer, very bright gal, very. And she said, I thought I saw Don in downtown Denver. And she said, so when I came home here I started looking up in the telephone book and I saw "Plisky". And so while we were in Colorado, we were very good friends. And then recently, there's a gal that moved in another-- it's in this area, but it's Barnsley Way. And she was also in another sorority. And we go to the reunions together. She's a widow, and so she'll call me and say, you want to go? And yeah. So we've kind of renewed our-- and the funny part about Agnes is her name, is we went to elementary, junior high, high school, and Fenn together. Isn't it amazing? All through. And now in our senior years, we go to the reunions.
SPEAKER 1: Have you been to the one for Fenn that they have in June?
DOROTHY PLISKY: Well, the one was a 50 year reunion. It was a three or four day reunion. I was not-- is that what you're--
SPEAKER 1: Yeah, but you don't have to do all of it.
DOROTHY PLISKY: No, I didn't. And Agnes didn't want to either. And it was soon after my husband's death. And I wasn't going to go at all. But she called and said, how are you at driving downtown? And I said, well, I can still do it. So we drove. And we went for the luncheon which was very nice. Very nice. And we went last year too.
SPEAKER 1: That's what we're trying to get more people to come. So tell some of your other friends.
DOROTHY PLISKY: I will. And we'll probably go. Agnes and I will probably go next year too. And maybe we'll stay for-- do a couple of days instead of just luncheon. Some good memories, very good memories.
SPEAKER 1: Did you take part in any extracurricular activities at Fenn, or did you not have time?
DOROTHY PLISKY: I really didn't have time. We sang one year in our sorority. We had these contests in spring. So I did-- and I don't have much of a voice, but if you-- we did do that. But the extracurricular activities. Probably the only thing I did was I'm a pretty good swimmer. And so at that time, let's face it, the only good PE-- physical education class, PE classes, you either were swimming or playing basketball. And I was not a good basketball player. So I was swimming. And I got tired of that. So I asked-- do you remember Jane Pease?
SPEAKER 1: Yes.
DOROTHY PLISKY: Very nice lady. I said, Jane, I'm interested in dance, I really am. And she said, we don't have anything. I said, I know. But on my way home is a theater called Karamu. And it was an African-American arts school. But they accepted some of us. I said, I'd really like to try some of the interpretive dancing there. Could I get credit for my PE class? And she said, well, OK.
[LAUGHS]
So I did that for a year. And found out that I really wasn't a very good dancer, but I had a good time.
SPEAKER 1: Yeah. Do you still go to some of their-- because Karen was still [INAUDIBLE].
DOROTHY PLISKY: No no, I don't. I don't. I did-- I really loved the dance, the interpretive dancing that they did. I guess today, they have another name for it. But I was out of the pool.
[LAUGHS]
And doing something a little different. So it was nice. It was good experience. But my activities in school were-- you're right, between working and going to school, they were really limited. I think I joined a sociology club for two years. But then when I decided to teach, I think I still went, but I wasn't really very active in it. And for some strange reason, I never joined Future Teachers of America. Shame on me.
[LAUGHS]
SPEAKER 1: There were-- definitely, there were clubs for teachers.
DOROTHY PLISKY: Yeah, there were. I don't know where I was. But Fenn leaves a lot of fond memories for me, a lot of good memories. And I am just so very, very grateful to have that opportunity, to have had that opportunity.
SPEAKER 1: Well, that's what we like to hear, I guess you might say.
DOROTHY PLISKY: Yeah. It's certainly-- I mean, you cannot explain-- and most of my friends that I-- have not had the opportunity to go to college, and they'll say, oh, you were so lucky, you were-- and at first I resented them saying how lucky I was, because I worked very hard.
But then I thought, no, I was lucky. A door opened for me. And I'll tell you, one of the problems that the women had at Fenn is parents objecting, especially the fathers. Why are you going to school? You shouldn't be doing that. You get married, you have babies, take care of them, blah, blah, blah, blah, the whole thing.
And some of them, even Ruth for a while, she had such a hard time that she had to live at the Y for a while. And that was hard, very hard. My circumstances were a little different.
My mother said, well, she-- I didn't I wouldn't say she discouraged me, but she would say, if you think you can do it financially, if you can hold on to it, go for it.
And my old grandfather, I had him thoroughly confused. Because he'd say, girl, where are you going? And I'd say, grandpa, I'm going to school. And he'd say, that's a good girl, that's a good girl.
Three months later. Girl, you know, I dressed a little different. Girl, where are you going? Grandpa, I'm going to work. Oh, that's a good girl. Can you imagine every three months. He must have thought, that poor girl doesn't know what she wants to do.
But he never-- he was pretty good about it too. So I was fortunate that way, because I'll tell you, I listened to a lot of those girls complain about how hard it was for them at home.
So it wasn't that hard for them in school. I think it was harder for them at home. A lot of objection.
SPEAKER 1: That's interesting. You don't think about that so much nowadays.
DOROTHY PLISKY: Oh, absolutely not. Absolutely not. But that's how it was. It was mostly blue collar working families, worked hard. And they were entitled to that opinion.
I'm not criticizing it, because that's what they were raised with. And so they just probably just didn't understand the value. And it was hard-- once we got rolling in school, it was hard to explain why we kept going back, but we just, call it perseverance, call it being stubborn, call it determination. Whatever you want to call it, we just kept going back till we finished.
SPEAKER 1: I think that's a thing to admire, because the women in those years really did persevere.
DOROTHY PLISKY: Oh Yeah.
SPEAKER 1: They had to--
DOROTHY PLISKY: Oh yeah.
SPEAKER 1: --push on and overcome objections--
DOROTHY PLISKY: Did you have objections at home?
SPEAKER 1: I didn't. But I was in a similar situation to you. I was with my mom. And it was like, well, if you can afford it, you know, I'll pay room-- I mean, you can stay home and pay for the food and everything, but you're going to have to pay your own tuition. It worked then. As you said, with co-op, it works.
DOROTHY PLISKY: It worked. It worked financially, and it worked with education. It worked with getting experience. By the time I did my student teaching, it was-- I hate to say, it was a breeze. I knew what-- and you hear all these horror stories about people going into their student teaching.
Well, not so much today, because I think colleges today-- I know they are-- they get their students out. My granddaughter is already volunteering in a school and she's just a freshman at Bowling Green, you know? So they get their students out in schools right away now.
And that's good. But there was a time when you went to school, you're a senior, you did your student teaching. And if you've never been in a school before, wow, that was a shock. Where we were at an advantage, definitely.
SPEAKER 1: Well, that was-- any other things you want to share?
DOROTHY PLISKY: No. I think we should stop and have a cup of tea now.
SPEAKER 1: Well, we appreciate your time.
DOROTHY PLISKY: Oh, sure. My pleasure, thank you. Thank you. OK? Postscript?
SPEAKER 1: A little postscript to add to Dorothy's story.
DOROTHY PLISKY: Yeah. Another one of my favorite courses was a religion course taught by Dr. Moore. Comparative religion was really a wonderful class. And my husband enjoyed it too, and he was an accountant. And so when he had to take a few arts and science courses he was a little disgruntled at times. But he really, he liked Dr. Cousins class and he really liked Dr. Moore's class. And Dr. Moore officiated our marriage in 1957, at the First Methodist church on Euclid Avenue. And it was a wonderful, wonderful experience. And we had such close ties with our professors. Because sometimes, we would have a class and we weren't finished discussing something. They'd say, well, let's go down to the cafeteria and have a cup of coffee, we'll finish talking about this. Or Panel Hall. I don't think kids get that today, students get that. And that was very nice. So thank you.
SPEAKER 1: Thank you.
DOROTHY PLISKY: Anything you want to erase.
